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[Webhead]

Why? If you are experiencing file access issues do you start by diagnosing the physical hard drive?

I agree with ceebee. That was weird.

Ok, I guess I must be high on drugs because this doesn't make any sense. Either that or you guys didn't read Pinnacle's scenario very closely. Or making you're just fucking with me? I have so many questions. First, what does diagnosing a hard drive have to do with the scenario Pinnacle described? Second, why would it be weird to look for unplugged cables in that scenario? Raising the white flag. I give up! What's the correct answer oh mighty know-everything-ceebee?

[CeeBee]

First, what does diagnosing a hard drive have to do with the scenario Pinnacle described?

Oh man, that's like troubleshooting 101 basics right there. Always start at the physical layer.

Second, why would it be weird to look for unplugged cables in that scenario? Raising the white flag. I give up! What's the correct answer oh mighty know-everything-ceebee?

Because at that point you don't have any indication that you should check the cable. Yes, it *COULD* very well be, just as well as it could be a workgroup switch in the middle that got disconnected from the core switch. All you know is that most/all network resources are inaccessible -> can't talk over TCP/IP.
WHY? because the link is down or because the traffic can't reach the destination
Do an IPCONFIG /ALL - inspect the adapter status - say you see media disconnected
WHY? Because the adapter is acting up or because the link is actually down.
Inspect the link light - say it's off - no link - bad cable or switch port

Now say the media didn't show disconnected - do you have a proper IP config? Can you ping by IP? Then look into firewall, more than one adapter and one with a low metric taking the traffic in the land of nowhere, static routes etc etc.

[Webhead]

Because at that point you don't have any indication that you should check the cable. Yes, it *COULD* very well be, just as well as it could be a workgroup switch in the middle that got disconnected from the core switch. All you know is that most/all network resources are inaccessible -> can't talk over TCP/IP.
WHY? because the link is down or because the traffic can't reach the destination
Do an IPCONFIG /ALL - inspect the adapter status - say you see media disconnected
WHY? Because the adapter is acting up or because the link is actually down.
Inspect the link light - say it's off - no link - bad cable or switch port

Now say the media didn't show disconnected - do you have a proper IP config? Can you ping by IP? Then look into firewall, more than one adapter and one with a low metric taking the traffic in the land of nowhere, static routes etc etc.

LOL. You love showing off your tech talk knowledge don't you? Ok. Well anyway, while you are doing all that, I'll just go plug the disconnected cable back in.

[74AD]

ipconfig/all is just as fast as checking the cable and it gives you a ton more information useful to troubleshooting the problem. When somebody calls me and says they can't access network resources the first thing I do is have them run ipconfig /all and give me the information. A disconnected cable will show there, as will a 169.254.XXX.XXX address, as will an improperly configured manual ip address, wrong dns server etc etc etc. Running ipconfig /all first puts me in a much better position to solve their problem quickly.

I agree with CeeBee on this one.

[Webhead]

ipconfig/all is just as fast as checking the cable and it gives you a ton more information useful to troubleshooting the problem. When somebody calls me and says they can't access network resources the first thing I do is have them run ipconfig /all and give me the information. A disconnected cable will show there, as will a 169.254.XXX.XXX address, as will an improperly configured manual ip address, wrong dns server etc etc etc. Running ipconfig /all first puts me in a much better position to solve their problem quickly.

I agree with CeeBee on this one.

What if their keyboard is disconnected and they don't realize it?

[74AD]

What if their keyboard is disconnected and they don't realize it?

just so I'm clear, when the user says they can't access the network you check their keyboard?

That's some great troubleshooting there.

[Webhead]

just so I'm clear, when the user says they can't access the network you check their keyboard?

That's some great troubleshooting there.

Ok Lance. Let's make sure you are very clear. You are asking people to type in commands. I am wondering what happens if their keyboard is disconnected. You understand how a keyboard would be relevant when typing in commands?

[Webhead]

But in all honesty, I don't think this is about keyboards or networks or anything else. There's something else going on here. I must really piss you guys off somehow because think about it -- we are squabbling over troubleshooting techniques based on a nonchalant post I wrote. I made the claim that it's always best to start at the physical layer when troubleshooting connectivity issues and as a result, I'm being fully shit on once again. I don't know what some of you are so butt hurt about but here we go again. Let's all gang on on Webhead. Lame. Are you that bored?

I just have one question though: Why do you guys put sooooooo much importance on the things I say? I'm nobody. You don't have to agree with me. But you also don't have to mob me every time I write something. Do you really hate me that much? I could leave if that would make you feel better? I don't have to post here if it makes you all happier. Geez. It's like every word that I write becomes a huge federal case here. So weird.

[CeeBee]

I made the claim that it's always best to start at the physical layer when troubleshooting connectivity issues and as a result, I'm being fully shit on once again.

Because you are plain wrong. We are not talking about a "my monitor is black" kind of issue - and even then you first press the power button and then check the power cable. Hell if the user reports that the optical drive doesn't read any CD you don't take apart the machine and mess with cables first, you check if the drive is visible to the machine (does it show in OS? nope.. does it show in BIOS? yes -> OS related... does it show in OS? yes, can you boot from a CD? no -> faulty drive or dirty lens).
What happened to critical thinking??? Really, WHY would you check a cable if you don't have any direct indication that it may be at fault? Sure, you can eliminate a potential issue, but it is just a link in a chain you haven't even started to explore.
Divide et impera.

[74AD]

But in all honesty, I don't think this is about keyboards or networks or anything else. There's something else going on here. I must really piss you guys off somehow because think about it -- we are squabbling over troubleshooting techniques based on a nonchalant post I wrote. I made the claim that it's always best to start at the physical layer when troubleshooting connectivity issues and as a result, I'm being fully shit on once again.

and there's the problem. Being disagreed with and proven wrong is "being shit on" according to you. I get it. you can't handle being wrong; you can't handle being disagreed with, but if you look at what I posted, which was purely technical explanation of why I agreed with Ceebee and how you responded to it, I'm pretty sure I wasn't the one being a defensive douche and shitting on anybody.